My new cichlids.

[iron]

I recently have gotten some new cichlids. I am really happy with these little guys. Not very big fish, but they are pretty neat. The first ones I got were 3 Kribbesis. A breeding pair and a young baby. Hes about maybe an inch long. The female is a dazzling beauty with her displays. The male is a territorial baby protector. They love their tubes and caves.
The second set are Johannis'. They are pretty kewl, I picked them up from a local breeder, Bristlenosedude ( real good guy) and I couldnt be pleased more. I was stuck on oscars, now Im really liking these guys too.
In a couple days I can post picks. I waiting for my tank to clear up. It is almost there.

[kSpieler]

Grats on the new fish! Are they all in the same tank?

[iron]

Yes they are in a community tank and having a ball. Its my super filtered tank. They are not Johanniis though they are Mainganos. Showing signs of breeding and pairing today. One built a nest by moving all the rock off the glass and I see he buried it while I was out. Not sure what that was all about. It was a ton of gravel so the little fart worked his hiney off to move it all. About 2 inch circle in diameter was removed and replaced.

[Phonetic Diabetic]

I have a johanni.....such a beaut. And always moving!

[EAST_TX_RN]

Wait, I am confused! Do you have all the fish you have listed in the same tank? :confused:

[Rift2Reef]

I hope they aren't in the same tank. Not only are the behaviors non compatible but the water parameters don't line up either.

Those Mainganos will kill those Kribensis. Mainganos also do not form pairs the male will breed with any willing female and females only want something to do with the male when it's time to spawn.

They really need their own tanks those fish are not compatible. Did you research these fish before purchasing them?

[iron]

The Mainganos do not mess with the kribbs in the slightest. They avoid them constantly. The Kribbs are kings in this tank. The kribbs stay in their one spot and defend it well. They really dont do much of anything until they eat or swim around the tank.
I cant tell you how many tanks I have seen on my wonderings that have been filled with good grief 10 and 30 different types of cichlids of different species. Not too mention fish not even close to the same region. No, I do not have all these fish in the same tank. If I did end up with some oddball species it is a simple remedy, dinner time. Ole Jack and Jill on the other side of the room will get fatter. I do not want mutts.
In fact the Mainganos have not been all that aggressive.

[EAST_TX_RN]

The Mainganos do not mess with the kribbs in the slightest. They avoid them constantly. The Kribbs are kings in this tank. The kribbs stay in their one spot and defend it well. They really dont do much of anything until they eat or swim around the tank.
I cant tell you how many tanks I have seen on my wonderings that have been filled with good grief 10 and 30 different types of cichlids of different species. Not too mention fish not even close to the same region. No, I do not have all these fish in the same tank. If I did end up with some oddball species it is a simple remedy, dinner time. Ole Jack and Jill on the other side of the room will get fatter. I do not want mutts.
In fact the Mainganos have not been all that aggressive.

Iron, you are very defensive! Believe it or not, we are trying our best to help you! You say they are in a community tank and have all those fish listed together, as if they are in the same tank.It is fine to have several different types of cichlids/fish together, as long as their water requirements are the same and they are COMPATIBLE! The Kribs may be kings at the moment, but not for long! I am not worried about some 'oddball' species, I am worried about the health and life of your fish! I keep getting the impression that you are adding more and more fish and just throwing them together. Sorry if I was wrong, but your postings did leave me to believe that.

[iron]

Im not being defensive, Im not attempting to anyway. Im trying to get fish that live in similar areas types of water in the tank. Im doing a search on one species right now trying to figure it out before I ask for help. I think I have been through about 400 fish looking for this one fish.
This is what is in the tank. I had a list of temps and ph and all that and there was a small difference between them all. I am going to have to look it all up. The temps were between like 78 and 80 degrees I think. The Ph was 7.0-7.4 I think. I need to find my list for certainty. I just got some holey rock today so I am hoping it will help a little. Im hearing people go up as far as 8.4 I think it was. My ph is about 6.8. My filtration is rated to filter 380 gallons combined.
Now I did have a little tiff in the tank. I redid the tank to create more territorial areas. So that the best side of the tank is neither left or right. Nor the center. It seemed to have settled the community down a great deal.
The Kribbs have gained without dispute a tubular structure I had bought. None of the fish bother it or near it. They just totally leave them alone. Its the center piece of the tank and in the open. The kribbs seem to love it.
I had snails in the tank and 4 long fin danios. None of them were being bothered but I put the snail with the Oscars and danios with guppies. The snails are about 4 times larger than the Oscar mouths.
The most drastic difference in fish are the bristlenose. They like it a bit cooler than what they have it. I was thinking they like the ph at 7.8. Thats about it in a nutshell. I will go ahead and get the numbers again to double check.

iron added 18 Minutes and 31 Seconds later...

Ok here are the numbers I just looked them up anew.

brisltenose
temp 80-86
ph 6-7.8
5-15 degrees

Maingano
temp 72-82
ph 7.5-9
hard water

Kribbensis
temp 71-81
ph 5.5-7.6
0-12 hardness

So If I maintain 7.5ph and 80 degree temps. I should be great. Right now Im a bit low. I will have to retest once the holey rock has been in there a couple days.

[Rift2Reef]

Im not being defensive, Im not attempting to anyway. Im trying to get fish that live in similar areas types of water in the tank. Im doing a search on one species right now trying to figure it out before I ask for help. I think I have been through about 400 fish looking for this one fish.
This is what is in the tank. I had a list of temps and ph and all that and there was a small difference between them all. I am going to have to look it all up. The temps were between like 78 and 80 degrees I think. The Ph was 7.0-7.4 I think. I need to find my list for certainty. I just got some holey rock today so I am hoping it will help a little. Im hearing people go up as far as 8.4 I think it was. My ph is about 6.8. My filtration is rated to filter 380 gallons combined.
Now I did have a little tiff in the tank. I redid the tank to create more territorial areas. So that the best side of the tank is neither left or right. Nor the center. It seemed to have settled the community down a great deal.
The Kribbs have gained without dispute a tubular structure I had bought. None of the fish bother it or near it. They just totally leave them alone. Its the center piece of the tank and in the open. The kribbs seem to love it.
I had snails in the tank and 4 long fin danios. None of them were being bothered but I put the snail with the Oscars and danios with guppies. The snails are about 4 times larger than the Oscar mouths.
The most drastic difference in fish are the bristlenose. They like it a bit cooler than what they have it. I was thinking they like the ph at 7.8. Thats about it in a nutshell. I will go ahead and get the numbers again to double check.

iron added 18 Minutes and 31 Seconds later...

Ok here are the numbers I just looked them up anew.

brisltenose
temp 80-86
ph 6-7.8
5-15 degrees

Maingano
temp 72-82
ph 7.5-9
hard water

Kribbensis
temp 71-81
ph 5.5-7.6
0-12 hardness

So If I maintain 7.5ph and 80 degree temps. I should be great. Right now Im a bit low. I will have to retest once the holey rock has been in there a couple days.

Iron for someone with just about zero experience you certainly are a know-it-all.

Those fish are not compatible in the slightest. We are only trying to help and ultimately people are just going to stop answering you. I don't see how it's so hard to research fish compatibility before you purchase them.

Did I miss where you mentioned what size tank they are in?

I'm sure if Phil(bristlenosedude) knew that you were putting those fish in with Kribensis he would of given you the same speech.

[iron]

I have had enough from you Dane.

[greeneyed]

They are only tring to help you.
Just because they are ok now, does not mean it will be the case when the Mainganos get older and start breeding.
These fish are not compatible.

[Rift2Reef]

I have had enough from you Dane.

Obviously you haven't. If you don't want feedback don't publicly post what you are doing. While you might not like what I am saying you obviously are shopping at places with far less educated individuals who do not care what you put in your tank.

I'm sorry that you don't like what I am telling you but it's the flat out truth. I want you to get as much out of this hobby as I have the last 16 years. These are living creatures and you have yet to show that you have their best interest at heart. I am not trying to criticize you I am trying to get you on the right track, doing the right things and ultimately enjoying this as much as every other member here.

It may be harsh but you can ask any of my customers I will refuse to sell them fish or corals that I think aren't compatible or will not live. I didn't get into this to get rich if that was the case I would of kept my other job.

If you don't want my opinion don't publicly post what fish you have and what you are doing. On the flipside if you just listen to what I am saying you will avoid 90% of the mistakes myself and many others have made.

[iron]

Iron for someone with just about zero experience you certainly are a know-it-all.

Where on earth did you get this? Completely reading something into me that is not true. If I was a know it all, I would not have asked people for help in the past, I wouldnt be reading books.
I find this comment very insulting. You are trying to assume I am this and it plain and simply is not true. Though you have done this on other occasions where you had been insulting and degrading to me as if I were trash. If you want people to care about what you say, say it nicer. Otherwise, you just piss them off. I have had enough harsh crap in my life I do not need it from someone that is clueless to who I am. Come on Dane, relax and stop thinking the worse.

Those fish are not compatible in the slightest. We are only trying to help and ultimately people are just going to stop answering you.
Dane, you have insulted me so many times it isn't funny. You have assumed so much from me its unreal. Considering me uneducated and a know it all. If you want to help, stop insulting me. I will listen with all my strength.

I don't see how it's so hard to research fish compatibility before you purchase them.
Now where on earth would I find this handy little knowledge. Where is the book for this? Everyone has different opinions on what works and what doesn't. So where is the concrete master manual on this subject. I would love to have it.


Did I miss where you mentioned what size tank they are in? After the last fiasco, why on earth would I say anything about my tank sizes. You had derailed me big time the last time I mentioned it. I have my fish in big enough tanks. You will just need to accept that as it is.

I'm sure if Phil(bristlenosedude) knew that you were putting those fish in with Kribensis he would of given you the same speech.
Unless his opinion differed from yours, which I have no idea because I do not recall asking him about it. I would also add that Phil is very qualified to state facts being the extensive experience he has, and the college education he has on the subject. I would fully accept what he had to say on the subject anytime any day.
Not to mention he is helpful and nice the entire time he speaks to me and I am sure anyone else. I walked away with a great deal more knowledge than I had walked in with. The knowledge was worth more than the fish in my eyes.



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iron added 11 Minutes and 56 Seconds later...

Greeneyed, Dane and I are not seeing eye to eye on our personalities. For some reason Dane believes I am thinking and acting in a certain way that I am not. Until that is worked out, we will be at odds I suppose. Im tired of the insults from him. Thats the bottom line.
Assuming someone is thinking this way and that is not a good idea. Posts display words not emotions, not expressions physically. So it isnt too easy to read into what is being said. It isn't assured that what you are saying is going to be understood. People take things wrong. I was taken wrong by Dane and perhaps I took what he has said wrong. Regardless there is friction. When it is ironed out things will be better. If its ironed out.

[OOwl]

Dane, I'm sure you would never talk to someone the way you address yourself to Iron in your store. I have no doubt but that you want the best for your fish but people are important too. I really hate it when I see a new hobbyist with lots of passion for the hobby constantly belittled and insulted on forums such as this. Please feel free to provide solid references (e.g., book titles, websites with more in-depth research on a certain species); those are going to be more positively received than overt rudeness. I've met Iron and he is not the "know-it-all" you paint him to be. He very much is open to learning about the hobby. If he makes a mistake or two in his journey, is he not allowed that the same way you or anyone else has done in our own path through the hobby?

[Rift2Reef]

Iron for someone with just about zero experience you certainly are a know-it-all.

Where on earth did you get this? Completely reading something into me that is not true. If I was a know it all, I would not have asked people for help in the past, I wouldnt be reading books.
I find this comment very insulting. You are trying to assume I am this and it plain and simply is not true. Though you have done this on other occasions where you had been insulting and degrading to me as if I were trash. If you want people to care about what you say, say it nicer. Otherwise, you just piss them off. I have had enough harsh crap in my life I do not need it from someone that is clueless to who I am. Come on Dane, relax and stop thinking the worse.


I have never personally insulted you. I have never been rude I have just been straight to the point and you don't like what I say because it goes against what you want to do.

What I mean by you being a know it all is that you do not listen to the advice people give you if it goes against what you want to do. If you ask for advice then argue over the answers it makes you a know it all. What is the point of asking for advice if you do not listen to it? I have tried to be direct as possible with you to try and give you information to make you succeed. If you want to be defensive and accuse me of attacking your personality that's fine but everyone else who reads the thread will have a differing opinion. If I didn't care I wouldn't waste my time responding to your threads and trying to help. I'm busy doing this while other stores are busy taking your money and selling you fish you shouldn't have.

Phil(Bristlenosedude) is a wealth of knowledge and a very nice guy. You are spot on. My point was that had you told him you were putting those fish in with Kribensis he would of told you the same thing that I am. Your statement about Phil also went to the heart of the problem. If you aren't sure on fish compatibility why not ask? You didn't ask him if they were compatible. You aren't doing proper research before adding fish together and that's why you are getting the reaction that you are getting from myself and others. It's not personal I am sure you are a very nice person. From what I hear you are. It's about the fish and the hobby man it's not personal. When everyone tells you the same thing over and over why single anyone out?

Rift2Reef added 7 Minutes and 42 Seconds later...

Dane, I'm sure you would never talk to someone the way you address yourself to Iron in your store. I have no doubt but that you want the best for your fish but people are important too. I really hate it when I see a new hobbyist with lots of passion for the hobby constantly belittled and insulted on forums such as this. Please feel free to provide solid references (e.g., book titles, websites with more in-depth research on a certain species); those are going to be more positively received than overt rudeness. I've met Iron and he is not the "know-it-all" you paint him to be. He very much is open to learning about the hobby. If he makes a mistake or two in his journey, is he not allowed that the same way you or anyone else has done in our own path through the hobby?

I don't see a problem with how I addressed him. You've been in my store numerous times and you know that I don't deal negatively with customers. I tell them the right and wrong thing to do and it usually leads to success. When someone repeatedly ignores sound advice and then debates responses why ask questions? I was not rude I was frank and to the point. Why recommend books and websites when they are going to give the same exact information that I gave and will be ignored?

We are dealing with live animals here I don't feel that it's ok to let them kill each other so someone "learns their lesson".

The posts are being mis interpreted which often times happens on the internet. I just want him to be successful and not hate fish a year from now and get rid of everything because things are dying and killing each other. It's how I am with all new hobbyist I see too many people get in and out of this hobby because they got bad advice from a chain store or even a book. There are many fish books out there that are worthless.

[tsunderl]

Ok folks... This is getting old. Not everybody is going to agree with everybody, no matter how many years experience you may or may not have. And not everybody is going to get along. Iron and Dane, you two obviously mix like oil and water. Leave it at that and MOVE ON! Butting heads will get you no where!

[iron]

iron added 1 Minutes and 27 Seconds later...

Ok folks... This is getting old. Not everybody is going to agree with everybody, no matter how many years experience you may or may not have. And not everybody is going to get along. Iron and Dane, you two obviously mix like oil and water. Leave it at that and MOVE ON! Butting heads will get you no where!


I agree. back on topic. Is there anyone else with opinions for or against this set up?

[EAST_TX_RN]

http://i242.photobucket.com/albums/ff171/SHARONKS/smilies/MIND.jpg

[Rift2Reef]

Well not everyone agrees with you Dane. I am not a know it all as you assumed again. You have been insulting as well. I do not know how you can not see that. I have heard over and over that you are the biggest know it all of anyone in this forum. Im saying dial it down and dont assume so much. I have taken tons of advice of others, thats what all my tanks represent. Every single one of them is built on the advice of others. Not by my knowledge, becasue I freely admit, I have none in this. Reread every post reply you sent to me. If you cant not find one thing insulting or degrading, there is no way anyone can show it to you.
So with the same regard, listen to what I am saying and learn from it. Ease up. You are making people mad by your harsh and rude statements. Again, I have had too many PMs to list about people who ignore you and dislike you because you are a jerk. I get countless PMs from people saying you are a mouthy know it all. So, Im trying to help you with the communications, like you are trying to help me with the fish. You pay for your words. Good or bad, you pay for them. They will always come back to haunt you. Or to reward you.
I will definitely consider any advice I get and with a watchful eye determine what to do. I dont want static in my life, I certainly am not building aquariums to be full of it.
I can not tell you how much your popping off has cost your business. It has though. Tone it down. Thats all. That simple. Things will be better than they are now. Be greatful you have a business in this day in age. Be good to your customers and they will flood your store. Be a jerk, and they will take thousands elsewhere.

Iron what you have heard is probably correct. I am one of the biggest know it alls on this forum. Everything I am saying is from actual real life experience. Some people don't like it others don't care. You have to be part of the "inner circle" in order for it to be accepted otherwise.

A jerk...Not so much. A know it all? I could see that. If being honest with people and telling them what they need to hear makes me a jerk? I'm ok with it. One thing you won't ever be able to say is that fish were killed because of me or that you lost money because of me.

I would rather miss a sale than sell something to someone they aren't prepared to deal with. I haven't referred you to any books or websites because many of them are worthless. The problem with the internet is everyone gets to voice their opinion without being pre qualified. Imagine if just anyone could report the news or write articles in the newspaper.

There are many people on the Fishbox that have gotten their "experience" vicariously through the fishbox or the internet. Keep that in mind and know that I am not trying to be an asshole to you I want you to succeed. You are going to make mistakes we all do.

[bra8ndy8]

Or just think you know it all......same thing! :p:

[iron]

Im glad I dont, I would get to many headaches from all that knowledge.:fw:

[kewlkatdady]

Iron,

you find that there are some people on this site that are A$$holes...not because they are mean, but more because they are blunt on very to the point. it's hard to the physical language that makes these comments ok in person. My suggestion...don't get so defensive and have thicker skin. :D

I put the smilie in to make shure you understand that I'm not being rude.

As for Dane, yeah he's one the resident know it all assholes on the board. But his heart is in the right place as he really wants to give you good advice. And so far he is 100% correct in everthing that he's said to you regarding your fish and the tanks they are in.

my .02

[iron]

Jerod, I stood next to you and got to know you a bit. We bsed for a couple hours. So I have a pretty good idea where you are coming from in discussions. Thats the difference. I have seen a terrible fight break out, the ending up splitting up a huge group of friends over emails that were misinterpreted. This communications in forums are not a solid sense of a read on anyone. Thats why we need to be more tacticool when speaking to eachother. Dane just threw in all kinds of remarks that set me off. Those remarks I didnt take lightly. However, I think Dane knows he crossed the line and I am in hopes he will iron this little problem out for himself and his business.
When you get to know me and we kid around, alright. But if you dont know me or anyone else for that matter, dont start up with a derogatory remarks. Be a bit nicer and get to know the person first.
So that yall know, I am in a good mood and in fact smiling a little. I am trying to be helpful. I am not, nor do I desire to degrade or hinder anyone. Im a joker and I love to prank some times.
Oh and to be up front, all of my fish are juvies except my guppies and kribbs. They are just tiny little fellas for the most part. So the aquarium sizes will go up soon by a great deal. So on that end, no I have in fact listened and am working towards the goals. Right now I am ironing out details and the proper builds and such. The best habitats I can make and the chemistry of the tank. Not to mention learning my fish.
As I was told by a much wiser man than me concerning the cichlids. Break down the tank and re arrange everything. Give them a couple days and they will all find their spots and be happy. This way you destroy everyones territory and they have to create new ones. It destroys a bunch of anxiety as well. I did that and it worked great. It took them about 2 hours or so of wrestling around and they all found a spot. They arent fussing in the slightest. (they are sitting right next to me) So I am going to watch and see how it goes. I have several back up tanks free if things get out of control.
Yes Dane I heard your advice and I am considering it. All advice I listen to and then I process the route I will take. So I have never shrugged anything off. My entire system is built from the advice of many on this forum. Everything I do is literally off of the advice. Also some reading I have done. So relax everyone. :) Im soaking it in like a dry sponge tossed into water. :D

[EAST_TX_RN]

Iron, I know you are new and have a lot to learn. I come across harsh, aka, bitchy sometimes, especially when I think someone is not listening to what I or others are trying to get across to them. What I am concerned over, is that you keep acquiring new fish, when you are still so new about keeping fish. You are also mixing fish that should not ever be in the same tank, such as guppies, the rhabdos, yellow lab,etc. I don't care if they are juvies or not, they should not be in the same tank. The fact that they are shows that either 1. you are not listening, or 2. don't care, or 3. blonde.:D
I kindly suggest slowing down and not adding any more fish and get these fish into separate tanks. Take some time, and soak up all the learning you can. When I first became a member here I had a lot to learn and made a few mistakes, but even then, I knew not to do some of the things you have done. When you make as many threads as you have and post about what you are doing(which shows good enthusiasm), understand that we will want to let you know about it when you mess up. Some of us are better at telling it than others, and some would rather just ignore the problems, just to be nice or indifferent. That's my 2 cents.:)

[kSpieler]

Semi-jack incomming ... I don't have the time right now to actually read all this, I just skimmed over it.

What I would like to offer is that it's really hard (if not impossible) to accurately convey "tone of voice" by email, texting, forums ... anything written/typed, as it is all subject to the way each reader perceives it. And that goes double for messages (etc.) written in haste or replies to already misperceived posts.

That's not to say though, that you can't convey sarcasim, pertinaciousness, or the general fact that your head is so far up your a55 that you can see the backs of your teeth!

It just means that the written word is not a 100% foolproof method of communication ... that's what smilies are for!!!! :brandy: :D

[mrsadler]

:drinking4::happydrunks:I HAVE A GREAT IDEAL LETS ALL ..... the thing o like about this fish box family is that we all have different views but we still have fun :exactly:

[iron]

We are so inbredded that we are back to be pure breds. lmao

[chuck_w]

This has been an interesting read guys. Why did everyone get so defensive? Was it because Iron was not taking everyones advice? Or did things really get going because Dane called Iron a know it all? Have you guys been at odds before? Maybe this thread should be closed or moved to the sump?

[bra8ndy8]

Everyone worked out their differences.......so I think the thread is fine. It shows people how to talk to each other, and there is a lot of information in the thread.

[mrsadler]

like alway greatly put :brandy:Everyone worked out their differences.......so I think the thread is fine. It shows people how to talk to each other, and there is a lot of information in the thread.pssssssssssst
...............

can someone pass me the yeager pleas :hehe:

[bra8ndy8]

Thank you......Thank you.....
Now go fill up my glass of wine! :D