Thoughts on safely/reliably lowering pH

[drag13honda]

Hello. My water comes out of the tap with about 7.4 - 7.6 pH. It's somewhere in between. On the API test kit the low range pH reads a maximum of 7.4, which is what mine reads. Then the high range pH reads a minimum of 7.6, which is what mine reads. So according to that i am somewhere in that range.

I am looking to safely lower some of my tanks pH to match those of some fish i wish to keep. I know driftwood lowers the pH some, but varies from piece to piece on how much and you generally have to have lots of wood for a small drop.

I've heard of some people using peat - has anyone here had experience? Anybody know where to get it locally?

And of course RO water. Is there a certain percentage of tap water you have to keep mixed in? I know the fish and (live) plants require some of the minerals in tap water, i just wasn't sure if there was a specific amount you had to have to maintain a healthy aquarium.

Please let me know what you know about these methods, and of course let me know if there are others i'm overlooking. I'm hoping to learn as much as i can.

Thanks, Matt

[Typical Tony]

Driftwood can lower more than you think, especially malaysian driftwood.

Ive seen people use peat moss from HD but be wary of them. I know Fluval makes peat pellets you can use in your canister filter, i think there's another company out there that does it also.


If using RO water, you can either mix it with some tap to get the minerals needed by fish and plants or you can get some seachem equilibrium to add in.

What kind of fish are you planning on adding? unless they are wild types, i wouldnt worry to much about lowering your ph that much to accommodate them, most fish nowadays are kept in mid to high ph in lfs anyway

[drag13honda]

Yes, they're wild specimens. :silence:

I will look into equilibrium. Is there a set pH, acidity, hardness of RO water, or does it differ?

RO would probably be the easiest most reliable option, assuming that it is all the same and doesnt fluctuate.

[Typical Tony]

LOL i just happened to have a bottle of equilibrium on sale

what kind of wild specimens are they? you can slowly acclimate them to water you have now.

I have a trio of wild caught peppermint BNs and they are doing fine in my 45g.

[drag13honda]

Awesome man, I'll take it. Is it the larger bottle? (i forget the sizing on them). Why are you selling it?

Most currently wild blue rams. Later i will be venturing into altum angels. :cool:

I've heard the rams need water in the range of 6's on the pH scale to breed (which i hope to accomplish). The lower into the 6's or even in the 5's the better. And same for the altums, except i hear it is a mandatory requirement, no questions asked, for them.

I've also heard that in order for them to live a full happy life they need the water chemistry matched to their natural habitat. They can be converted over, within reason, and live okay. But from what everyone says they don't thrive. It's all he said, she said at this point. I've never tried it myself, but at this point i'm taking the word of others who have been there as i feel they are more qualified. It may be overkill, but i'd rather be safe than sorry.

[Typical Tony]

i forgot the size but i was thinking of going RO when i got it but then saw how much it actually cost to maintain it so i didnt.

Fish Gallery got some wild caught rams that are acclimated to dallas water.

I dont really know that much about altum angels, just that the wild caught ones are pretty hard to come around.

[drag13honda]

I've pretty much decided on RO water as it sounds like the safest method. THis is probably a stupid question, but how much water can you change at once without killing the biological bacteria?

Obviously i need to keep the tank stable, but i need to lower my pH at the same time. If i only do small water changes daily it will work, but slowly. Ideally if i could just drain all of the water (without siphoning my sand, which would still leave a good inch, inch and a half of water) and add all new RO water that would pretty much put me at all RO water. This way i don't have to worry about the pH drop on water changes being stressful until i get the tank fully RO water. I just fear that this would be too much at once (i've never done much over a 50% water change in emergency situations). Of course if you scrubbed anything or added chlorinated water (which i wont) it would kill the bacteria.

Pretty much, if i don't touch anything else, how much water could i safely drain and add directly back to the tank?

[Nicholsons_Discus]

The quickest way to kill your fish is to start messing around with the water chemistry. The fish will adapt to your water without any problems. Problems occur when your ph bounces. This is a common problem that occurs when you try to change your ph. My suggestion is to just leave it alone. Keep it warm and clean and you wll have success.

-john

[drag13honda]

I wouldn't be doing any changing with fish in the tank. It would be done between fish (old ones come out, new ones go in). I was under the impression if you changed the water out to RO water you would have a constant pH of the RO water.

What pH are the fish being kept at now? I've sent you a couple of messages but haven't heard anything back. Because i don't know what their current water chemistry is like i was just going off of what they naturally are used to. If they are already in water very close to mine i will just acclimate them over to my current water.

[tsunderl]

The quickest way to kill your fish is to start messing around with the water chemistry.

I agree 100%. Fish are very adaptable. XTC got some fish from me once and called me shortly after asking what I did to my water since the pH was 6. Nothing. That happened to be a tank that had no crushed coral or holey rock, a rather good sized piece of driftwood, and no chemical or other means of altering the pH. I tested the water and yep, 6. I then tested all my tanks and those that had no holey rock were 6.0 to 6.4 and the tanks that did were around 8.0. My tap water at that time was in the 6's. Seems the tanks with holey rock are consistantly around 8 and those without range from 6.0 to 7.4. I'd say it depends on the pH of the water when I do water changes.

Guess I'd be concerned if I had fish real susceptable to pH changes, but mine are tough. Gotta be to be my fish! :D

Spxsk has altum angels. Pick his brain regarding the pH of the water they are in.

[Nicholsons_Discus]

If you have not gotten my messages then there is a problem somewhere because I have answered everyone of them. I have bred discus for years, I have bred angelfish, killifish, bettas, rams, some africans, and I don't know what else and I have never once checked my ph, nor will I. If you keep the water clean and at the right temp 99% of all fish will be fine. Messing with the water chemistry is just a disaster waiting to happen. You still want me to bring the fish over on Friday morning?

-john

[drag13honda]

I got the last message you sent and responded, let me know if you don't get it. I just want to verify, i wasn't trying to call you out and make it sound like you're intentionally ignoring me. I understand sometimes things come up and you can't get to a computer, or even, that sometimes a computer has glitches and for some reason doesn't perform the correct task. With that said, i'm not saying it was intentional, i was just asking if you had seen them, in case something like this happened. I sent you a response before i saw this, so don't worry about the water chemistry part.

And yes, i am very interested in picking the fish up friday still, that was part of the messages that disappeared. Just let me know what time i can expect you there and i will be there.

Thanks, matt

drag13honda added 5 Minutes and 11 Seconds later...

I agree 100%. Fish are very adaptable. XTC got some fish from me once and called me shortly after asking what I did to my water since the pH was 6. Nothing. That happened to be a tank that had no crushed coral or holey rock, a rather good sized piece of driftwood, and no chemical or other means of altering the pH. I tested the water and yep, 6. I then tested all my tanks and those that had no holey rock were 6.0 to 6.4 and the tanks that did were around 8.0. My tap water at that time was in the 6's. Seems the tanks with holey rock are consistantly around 8 and those without range from 6.0 to 7.4. I'd say it depends on the pH of the water when I do water changes.

Guess I'd be concerned if I had fish real susceptable to pH changes, but mine are tough. Gotta be to be my fish! :D

Spxsk has altum angels. Pick his brain regarding the pH of the water they are in.

Maybe i am wrong, but i thought he had scalare "altums"? Which are still wild caught fish but not the true altum angel. THey are similar, yet are still different. From my understanding wild scalares are more adaptable than the true Orinoco Altums.

[Nicholsons_Discus]

Got your message and answered again...LOL. All is good.

-john

[drag13honda]

Sent another message back, in case we have another issue arise in the message sending.